Saturday, January 27, 2007

A follow-up to my last post on skepticism

Did I really mean everything that I typed in my last post about this? Yes and no.

I have done a lot of thinking over the last several months. The truth is, I never really feel like I know who I am or where I stand.

I feel deep down inside of myself that for probably many reasons that I would still adhere to many of the tenets of faith as laid out by Christianity....or at least what I understand to be Christianity. I really want to believe in the authenticity, veracity, trustworthiness, etc...of the Bible. I really want to believe that I am right about everything that I believe too. So what is my major hang-up?

My biggest hang-up is that I, along with everyone else, believe that I am right. So how do we know who is right? Even in my "Christian walk" I have gone from believing one thing so very certainly to believing something else just as certainly. Here are some simple examples-

Creation- I used to believe that the Genesis creation account was literal. I truly believed that the only acceptable interpretation of it was the way I saw it. The current view that I would hold if I took myself seriously is that the Genesis accounts are allegorical in nature and that there is no historical or scientific data to back it.

The Bible- As a "younger" Christian I believed firmly that the Bible was written directly by the hand of God and therefore was completely perfect in every way; historically, spiritually, grammatically....and that it was only to be taken at face value. Since then I have come to believe/understand that these are not the cases. I don't believe that God wrote it directly, but that rather it is a work of men who had been moved to write various things in a similar way that perhaps writers and artists have been "inspired" to do their work.

Eschatology- As a younger Christian I believed that closer to the dawning of the end of time that all of the Church would be raptured up into heaven and then the world would experience all hell breaking loose on earth. That there would be 3 1/2 years of peace followed by 3 1/2 years of what would be called "The Great Tribulation." This person would come as a great world leader and deceive everyone into following them into a 1-world-government. Then all of the rest of what was written in the book of Revelation would have its literal fulfillment here on earth. Then the more I studied I came to the other conclusion that the "Tribulation" that Jesus talked about already happened with the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. That there was no future anti-Christ; and that the book of Revelation and the apocalyptic writings of the prophets were simply allegorical for overriding spiritual realities.

Retribution- I used to believe in a literal Hell where people who "rejected" Christ went to burn forever and ever. Then the more that I studied, the more convinced I became that the Bible taught more of an annihilation perspective on Hell. That people didn't burn forever, but were tormented for a time and then evaporated into nothingness.

These are just some things....but the point is that there are so many different view out there. All of these different views come from the study of one source; The Bible.

Steve, I understand and respect your position that it is hard to trust and rely on any human as we are all full of our own ego and agenda....and yet while I agree with that, there also seems to be irony in that we cannot survive without each other. How do we learn anything? Usually from another physical source. If it is not a physical source, but rather a spiritual source then with all of the variety how is one to know which path is right?

Are there nuggets of truth in each variety? Do Baptists have something that the Catholics don't and vice-versa? Do the Hindus see something that the Muslims don't? Do the Muslims see something that the Buddhists don't? Could they all be interrelated? Could they all be part of a mosaic that can't truly be seen from inside itself? Or could each group be just as inventive as the next? Could they all be completely full of crap?

These are the issues that I wrestle with.

"Wise counsel" usually leads me to do something about a particular situation or thought process. The advice is usually connected to some type of cause and effect. "If I do this, then that will happen." And then if the prescription is not followed then it is decided by others that the person isn't trying hard enough.

There are just lines of certain reason that don't always follow. As Christians we often fault skeptics and lunatics for believing things that aren't true. We tell them that "you can believe that as much as you want but it doesn't mean that it will make it come true." The same thing could be true of us too.

For example- I, unfortunately, listen to a certain broadcast over the Internet hosted by a Reformed Baptist who often has call in debates/discussions with atheists. His biggest argument against other religions is based on rational consistency as it relates to internal critiques. He says that pretty much any other religion than Christianity can be broken down to be found as false by performing an internal critique. The only problem is that anyone on the inside of a particular system has been conditioned to defend or uphold their system as being capable of standing up to the internal critique...it is just that you first have to lay hold of certain presuppositions. The issue with this Reformed Baptist is that he fails to see that to anyone outside of his franchise of Christianity, his views cannot stand the test of internal critique without faults being found. Perfection is in the eye of the subscriber.

The thing that I do like about the ideas brought forth in What the #$%@! do we know is that we are forced to be confronted with ideas that are outside of our normal realm of thinking. Our ideas of God are challenged by certain things in science...not necessarily negated, but challenged in our ideas.

On the other hand, I fear that the movie might provoke the thought that people are really in more control than what reality shows. Our own "will" can only go so far. There are limitations to the realities that we try and create...and whatever capacity of brain power that we are functioning at right now- that's probably as good as we'll ever be, unless we get struck by lightening or something else to open things up a bit.

Travis, I have not read your piece on the Shamans. I would be curious though. I think that I may have seen it briefly posted on your MySpace blog but I didn't really read it. {was in a hurry} Let me know if you can repost it or send it to me through email.... But in any case to your comments; I know that this is a new path, but I don't know what that path is and whether I should be wearing boots, sneakers, sandals, or going barefoot. And perhaps it will just bring me full circle back to my beginning. I have found that many times in my life I head down paths like this only to come back to where I started more deeply rooted than before.

Jason, I apologize that I haven't gotten in touch with you. I am deeply surprised that I've had time to even work on this post at all....[it's been written over several days as I've had spare moments]. I apologize if any of this comes as a shock or disappointment. I guess all I can admit to is my frail humanity that is subject to all sorts of things. And this is in no way intended to try and make others question their faith the way I am. My goal is not to try and plant doubt in any mind but rather just explore my own.

Concerning my reference to Robert Ingersoll; while he does have some valid points I really part ways with him when he chooses to refer to people of faith as "weak minded" or "uneducated." I think that is a bit ignorant on his part. Although, keep in mind though that he did not claim to be an atheist. I think that many people have misunderstandings about the difference between atheists and agnostics.

I believe in a God. I don't believe that all is left to chance. I don't believe that there are multiple spirits out there competing. What I don't know though is what God is truly about. Everyone seems to find Him/Her in their own right....and do they not have that right? Are they right? How can we be so right?

For now, my head hurts and I'm tired.

3 Comments:

Blogger Cooper said...

i shamaned my blog accout, i'll post it to myspace soon,

look up graham hancock

Sunday, February 04, 2007 8:48:00 PM  
Blogger Unknown said...

I get deep in thought and during that process start throwing away modern conceptions. I realize that I can not even take myself as a whole entity; I break down. I learn.

What can my fellow humans provide?

Answers?

I do not think so.

Examples?

Perhaps.

I must see that, uniqueness, is illusionary. Unique depends on circumstances, far beyond my perceptions. Fellow humans and I provide fodder for thought that reality is the here and now. We overlook the past and shun the future not understanding that we are all three: past, present, and the future.

I live in a world of probabilities, my probabilities. You live in your world, Jason in his. We interact with each other, changing our world as we speak, touch, feel. Destiny (future) and predestination (future based on past event or events) are part of the future, unseen. Yet, it is mine to have; yours to live.

Mmm, better to say this.

Humans will not be able to provide the “right” answer. We can not. This illusion of life depends on the probability of future interactions by the unseen, unknown forces, working, in part, on past events. Each human will have a finite (but close to infinite) number of changes (probabilities) in their life.

We think that in the Abraham/Isaac story (Genesis 22), Abraham only had one way to please God. He had to kill Isaac.

Really? Think this:
God could have had numerous probabilities for Isaac. I can think of many ie:
Abraham kills Isaac, then God raises Isaac up from the dead. Abraham dies, Isaac sacrifices the ram.
Use a little imagination and the list will grow..

Paul says in 1 Corinthians that we know in part and we prophesy in part (don’t know where that fits, but I throw it in)

I truly believe that God has a magnificence sense of humor. That he plays dice with the universe and hides the dice under the rug (Hawkins quote)

I completely feel that, at times, I should be able to know all, but that is pure ego, pride. I am finite and as such, I am totally unable to grasp the concept of infinite.

The crazy bunch of mixed up fellows I fellowship with, provide endless amounts laughter for God. The may be why I am here.. or maybe to provide some laughter for some person reading this blog..

Baptists or Catholic, Hindu or Muslim? Not sure it counts in the greater system of what is right


steve

Sunday, February 11, 2007 1:19:00 PM  
Blogger Unknown said...

Baptists or Catholic, Hindu or Muslim? Not sure it counts in the greater system of what is right



the above sentence can be taken wrong very easy.

If you look at the fact that all names mentioned are man made names it will help...

steve

Sunday, February 11, 2007 1:26:00 PM  

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